Episode 5 of Season II of “Budget Talks” focuses on life in front-line Mykolaiv.
What do the people of Mykolaiv hope for the most? Why can’t corruption in Ukraine be eradicated quickly? How is Denmark helping the city recover? And can Mykolaiv once again become a shipbuilding hub?
In this new episode of the “Budget Talks” podcast, we explore these and other pressing questions facing the city of shipbuilders. Head of the Center for Fiscal Policy Studies, Viktor Maziarchuk, and Mayor of Mykolaiv, Oleksandr Sienkevych, discuss the city’s most urgent problems and potential solutions.
VIKTOR
Welcome back to another episode of Budget Talks. Today, we’re speaking with Oleksandr Senkevych, the mayor of Mykolaiv — a city that’s been on the frontline since the beginning of the full-scale invasion. Mykolaiv and its residents have held strong despite daily threats, shelling, and destruction. Thank you for joining us today, Mr. Mayor. We’re glad to have you with us.
OLEKSANDR
Thank you for the invitation.
What’s happening with Mykolaiv’s budget?
VIKTOR
Let’s start with the budget of Mykolaiv. We actually quoted you recently — you mentioned that after the military income tax was taken away from the city budget, you had to consider staff cuts and potentially defaulting on payments for basic utilities like electricity. Could you tell us where things stand now financially? And did those difficult scenarios actually come to pass?
OLEKSANDR
Yes, they did. Honestly, things are still very tough, but we’re holding on. The clearest proof of that is the fact that last year — and again this year — Mykolaiv received direct subsidies from the state. That means the folks at the top know exactly what’s going on here — how much money we have and where we’re spending it.
Another indication of how bad things are: the last time we reallocated funds and tried to find money for roads, instead of adding money, we actually had to pull 9 million hryvnias out of the road budget.
VIKTOR
From the city budget?
OLEKSANDR
Yes, from the city budget.
VIKTOR
And where did that money go?
OLEKSANDR
To more critical needs — rebuilding damaged buildings, fixing roofs, repairing broken pipelines, and so on. At the moment, we’re even expecting a small surplus. But we also have a few municipal programs that are currently underperforming. Our municipal utility companies are fully funded for protected budget lines — like electricity and salaries — until the end of September. After that, we’ll need to look for ways to cover the remaining essential costs.
VIKTOR
From what I’ve seen, the city seems to be doing a solid job with tax revenues. I took a look at your budget and noticed that for some revenue streams — especially those tied to local taxation — you’ve even surpassed pre-war levels.
OLEKSANDR
That’s right. And that’s thanks to the people of Mykolaiv. Some have come back home and restarted their businesses. Others have returned and started entirely new ventures. The city council tries to support them — but really, they’re doing it on their own, expanding different sectors and, most importantly, paying official salaries and property taxes.
In 2025, we’re expecting revenue growth. In fact, from January through May 2025, revenues are already up 311 million hryvnias compared to the same period in 2024 — that’s a 20.7% increase. Income tax is up by 24%, land tax by 23%, the single tax by 8%, and the excise tax by 33%. By the way, we actually expected even higher revenue from the excise tax — but people are smoking and drinking less, which…
VIKTOR
…is great news — at least for the non-smokers!
OLEKSANDR
Exactly. People are cutting back on smoking and drinking, and that’s affected tax revenues. On the one hand, it’s unfortunate because it means fewer funds for the budget. Or rather, not a shortage — but a decrease. On the other hand, it’s a good thing. People are starting to care more about their health. Maybe they just want to see life a bit more clearly.
VIKTOR
So if I understand correctly, your city has managed to foster a good working relationship among local authorities, the national government — particularly the tax authorities — and the residents themselves, who understand that paying taxes helps both the army and the survival of the city.
OLEKSANDR
That’s exactly right. We all know the rule — what isn’t prohibited by law is allowed. And legally minimizing taxes is part of doing business. Every business owner looks for a lawful way to reduce their tax burden.
"All secrets after the war": how the city is supporting the army
VIKTOR
Speaking of money — who’s been hit the hardest by the loss of revenue? And I say “loss,” though to be fair, that’s not entirely accurate — because technically, these were funds the city never actually had. For years, military income tax was always remitted to the local budget. When the war broke out, you were expecting large expenditures, including support for the armed forces. Tell us: who’s been most affected? And what’s the current level of support for the military from Mykolaiv? We saw a figure showing that the city contributed 230 million hryvnias last year alone to support the army and defense units.
OLEKSANDR
That’s right. It’s important to note that in 2024, we received a 630 million hryvnia subsidy from the state budget. That means we were short on funds. At the same time, we continued supporting the army. You mentioned, “That money wasn’t really yours to begin with.” But we have to remember that in Mykolaiv, military income tax accounted for 26% of all personal income tax. So they didn’t just take away the money we were given — they took what we already had.
We also used to receive income tax from police salaries and similar sources — that’s gone too. And yes, while their salaries have gone up, the state subsidy was calculated based on how much we lost from that removed military income tax. Mykolaiv was one of the most militarized cities in Ukraine — we had the 36th Marine Brigade, the 79th Air Assault, and many others. I won’t go into too much detail for obvious reasons. After the Russian annexation of Crimea, even more military personnel were stationed here, and they paid their income tax to the local budget. When the full-scale invasion began and military salaries increased, we saw a major surge in revenue. And we made a decision: 10% of those funds would go directly to military requests. It was simple — we received the full amount of income tax, then divided and allocated 10% according to how much each military unit had paid into our budget. It was fair. They knew their numbers. We knew the numbers. They submitted the requests, and we either transferred funds or procured the items they needed and delivered them.
The second program we launched was for housing. We didn’t just buy apartments — instead, we allocated funds directly to specific brigades. They then selected recipients themselves: people who’d truly earned it. Not someone’s cousin or friend, but actual service members or families of fallen soldiers. Brigade commanders were responsible for compiling the lists, and the city’s garrison leadership signed off on them too — to ensure a double layer of accountability. We bought a significant number of homes and handed them over to the military. And even now, we keep getting requests asking whether the program will continue. We always say: if we have the funds, we’ll definitely keep supporting them.
We’re still supporting our defenders to this day. In fact, we often don’t even purchase equipment — we simply transfer what we have from our municipal enterprises or our reserves. This includes tools, building materials, gear — whatever’s needed. We’re also buying large numbers of FPV drones. And if you compare the price of our drones to market prices, ours are way cheaper, even though the quality is excellent. There’s a secret to that — but I’ll save that story for after the war.
VIKTOR
Sounds like you’re working with the right suppliers. And we hope the soldiers are making the most of that equipment. We connect the brigades directly to the drone manufacturers, which means the equipment gets customized on the fly, so to speak. It’s real-time collaboration and upgrades.
"A bullet changes a lot in your head, even if it hits you in the butt."
VIKTOR
You’re spending quite a lot to support the military and help internally displaced people who’ve relocated to Mykolaiv.Do local residents ever complain that you’re not spending enough on things like road repair? We’ve heard that healthcare is also struggling.
OLEKSANDR
Every sector is struggling. Because of the reduced budget, we’re only doing patch repairs on roads. No major roadwork on key streets. Funding is tight across the board. We wanted to reopen more schools, but without proper bomb shelters we couldn’t. So now, we’re operating the schools that do have shelters in two shifts — morning and afternoon. And yes, I get comments on social media all the time — Telegram, Facebook — whenever we post any updates, there’s always someone asking, “When are you going to fix our street?”
It’s often older residents. War or no war — they’re tired of knee-deep puddles. Of course, we take those requests into account, we make lists. But right now, we simply can’t afford to do it. That said, no one is really demanding that we stop helping the army. They’ll say, “We need our roads fixed,” but they never add, “Instead of helping the army.”
VIKTOR
That’s good to hear. I hope people understand the need for prioritization — and that the army comes first.
OLEKSANDR
I always quote Al Capone, the American gangster — he once said, “A bullet changes a lot in your head… even if it hits you in the ass.” I think a lot of Ukrainians — including people here in Mykolaiv — who once bought into Russian propaganda, thinking that “together we’ll be stronger,” had a serious shift in perspective after experiencing this war. The missiles, the drones, the destruction — all of it forced many to reconsider their views on Russia. Though unfortunately, there are still a few people who would probably get hit by a missile and still say, “Well, it’s not that simple.”
VIKTOR
I truly hope that most Ukrainians now see things clearly. russia is a terrorist state.
OLEKSANDR
Yes. But the fact that the Security Service of Ukraine keeps arresting collaborators in cities all over the country shows that, sadly, for some people, even a bullet to the ass doesn’t change anything.
"Cockroaches Don’t Like the Light": How Mykolaiv Rose in the City Transparency Rankings During the War
VIKTOR
In a wartime city so close to the front lines, how have you managed to maintain such a high level of transparency? Mykolaiv was recently ranked among the top ten most transparent cities in Ukraine, according to Transparency International. What’s your secret?
OLEKSANDR
There is no secret. I don’t believe corruption in Ukraine can be wiped out overnight. Corruption here is a deeply rooted cultural issue — even household corruption. Like when you go to the doctor…
VIKTOR
…with a box of chocolates.
OLEKSANDR
Or 50 hryvnias. Want to make sure they give you a proper IV or injection? Slip 50–100 hryvnias into their pocket. I give OLEKSANDR lectures at universities. Students often ask me, “What’s the hardest part of your job?” And I tell them: “It’s the daily struggle against temptation.” As mayor, I face countless temptations every day. One signature, one phone call, one meeting — and things could go in the wrong direction.
Temptation is a natural human condition. Even in the Lord’s Prayer, Christians ask God not to lead them into temptation — though, in truth, temptation comes from a very different source. If people are given the opportunity to abuse power — most of them will. So the system has to change. The person who makes the decisions and the person who benefits from those decisions — those two should never be the same. We need to separate those functions. People who issue permits or approvals shouldn’t have any direct contact with those who benefit from them. Because at its core, corruption is a two-way agreement.
VIKTOR
Someone gives, someone takes.
OLEKSANDR
Exactly. One side is willing to offer something to get a favor. The other side is willing to accept that deal. Today, transparency isn’t just a nice idea — it’s a necessity. We want to be part of the European community, part of the Western world — and that means corruption simply isn’t acceptable. Yes, corruption exists in European countries too.
But our key partner — and we’ll probably talk more about this later — is Denmark. Denmark has zero tolerance for corruption. They’re ranked number one in Europe in that regard. And it’s thanks to the EU Anti-Corruption Initiative, funded by Denmark, that we’ve been able to take big steps forward. They’re helping shape Mykolaiv’s image as a city that’s striving to be the most transparent in Ukraine.
VIKTOR
A city of integrity. In fact, in our last episode, we talked with colleagues from the EU Anti-Corruption Initiative. They told us about a project to modernize school kitchens — a great example of how international partners can support not just national-level reforms, but also local initiatives in cities like Mykolaiv. But going back to transparency: in 2020, Mykolaiv ranked 28th in the Transparency International rating. Now — just a few years later, and during wartime no less — you’ve climbed into the top ten. That’s a major shift.
OLEKSANDR
For the first time in years, we made a conscious decision to address the issue. We looked closely at what needed to change. The EU Anti-Corruption Initiative provided us with Yulia Mincheva, who’s now my external advisor at city hall. One of her main tasks was to raise our transparency score. Having an outsider’s perspective allowed us to spot problems, fix processes, and make changes where needed. But we’re not stopping here. It’s hard to maintain a spot in the top rankings — everyone’s trying to move up. We’ll have to keep making progress, adding new measures. And remember — we’re a frontline city. There are things we simply can’t make public. Still, we’re planning to become even more transparent.
As my mom used to say: “Cockroaches don’t like the light.” We want to shine as much light as possible on everything that happens at city hall. If we have nothing to hide, and we truly don’t, then let’s open everything up. First and foremost, we owe that to our residents — they need to trust their local government. Secondly, it’s crucial for our international partners. Russian propaganda — which they’ve spent billions promoting — paints Ukraine as completely corrupt. They point to our corruption scandals as proof. But the truth is: we’ve built numerous anti-corruption institutions, and they’re working. We hear about arrests, charges, investigations — and that’s a good thing. You don’t hear about that in Russia or Belarus. Does that mean they’re corruption-free?
VIKTOR
Of course not.
OLEKSANDR
In fact, I’ve always said that russian corruption has been our best ally in this war. Half of their tanks didn’t work. Half of their weapons didn’t fire — because corruption gutted their military from the inside. Transparency is crucial because we need our partners to trust us. We don’t want to be seen as beggars asking for handouts — like, “Give us a tracksuit, give us some canned food.” We want to be seen as equal partners — building companies, opening markets, creating jobs. When things are transparent, that’s when real trust is possible. And just to clarify — since the start of the war, Mykolaiv hasn’t received a single hryvnia from international partners directly into the city budget.
VIKTOR
You just answered my next question.
OLEKSANDR
That’s actually a core principle of mine — I don’t want to manage foreign money. Not because we couldn’t use it — but because I want to avoid any potential corruption scandals. We’re not ready for that yet. That’s why all international assistance flows through trusted international organizations. They handle procurement. They don’t send us money — they send us pipes, pumps, equipment, and everything else we need.
VIKTOR
And expertise too. I recently spoke with one of your fellow mayors from another regional center. I told him: “Mykolaiv isn’t taking foreign money into its budget — that’s Mayor Senkevych’s principled decision.” He responded, “That’s weird. Those international guys are even more corrupt than we are. We could’ve done everything just fine ourselves!”
OLEKSANDR
As for the international organizations — look, I’m not some gossiping grandma on a park bench. I can’t claim they’re all stealing — I have no such evidence. I haven’t seen any open-source investigations suggesting corruption in these organizations. What I can say is that managing these projects through international bodies is extremely expensive. People often say that corruption in Ukraine eats up 10 to 15, maybe even 20 percent of a project’s cost. Well, international project overhead often runs at that same level — 15 to 20 percent. That includes salaries, management, logistics, reporting…
So yes — it’s something worth analyzing. But ultimately, we’re not responsible for how those organizations operate. That’s their accountability, not ours.
VIKTOR
It’s a question of who bears the risk.
OLEKSANDR
And it’s up to our international partners to decide which organizations they trust and how to oversee them.
How Denmark “Adopted” Mykolaiv
VIKTOR
You’ve developed a unique relationship with the Danes. It seems Denmark has essentially adopted Mykolaiv — offering a level of support we haven’t seen elsewhere.
OLEKSANDR
I usually say they’ve “adopted” us.
VIKTOR
And we’re incredibly grateful to the taxpayers of the Kingdom of Denmark.
OLEKSANDR
Denmark is a small country with a huge heart — not in size, but in courage. It’s got the heart of a lion. Let me remind you — Denmark was the first country to commit to sending tanks. Then they were the first to announce they’d send F-16s. They also called on bigger, wealthier nations to follow their lead.
So yes — their budgets might be small compared to the global giants, but they’re doing a tremendous amount. They’re supporting us in ways that truly matter. Prime Minister Mette Frederiksen has visited Mykolaiv several times, often alongside President Zelensky. They’re not afraid to stand with us.
The relationship between Denmark and Mykolaiv is one-of-a-kind in Ukraine. It’s so unique that we had to make changes to Ukrainian legislation to make it work. Mykolaiv is now home to a branch office of the Danish Embassy — something that doesn’t exist anywhere else in the country. There are consulates, honorary consulates — but not full embassy representations.The Danish Ambassador to Ukraine, Ole Egberg Mikkelsen, personally came to open this office. Now we work very closely with them.
We’ve set up a steering committee that coordinates all our needs and projects. We calculate costs, discuss priorities, and Denmark allocates funding for both the region and the city. At the committee level, we — meaning the mayor, the city council secretary, the regional administration head, the regional council chair, the Ministry for Reconstruction, and the Danish government — make collective decisions. The Ambassador is also involved directly. We go through all the needs together — and whenever possible, we try to source the equipment from Denmark. So for example, if we need pumps for Mykolaivvodokanal, we look to buy Danfoss pumps made in Denmark and shipped here.
VIKTOR
Which, by the way, are top-notch.
OLEKSANDR
We’re now trying to shift the relationship toward business development. Just recently, we hosted representatives from Danish Industry — it’s an organization that unites around 2,000 Danish companies. And I told them — it’s time to move beyond donations. We can’t rely on handouts forever. We want partnerships. Last year, for example, we entered into a grant-supported credit arrangement to acquire Danish equipment. So we’re already transitioning to co-financing models with the Danish budget.
VIKTOR
Are there any emotional stories from your interactions with Danish leaders that really stayed with you? Something you’d like to share?
OLEKSANDR
There are many. These past three years have been full of moments like that. For instance, there was the Black Sea Security Forum in Odesa — and about a dozen of the attendees came to Mykolaiv afterward. I gave them a brief city tour, introduced them to local volunteers. And every Sunday in Mykolaiv, we hold a rally to support prisoners of war — it’s a regular event downtown. That day, about 300 people showed up. So I was explaining how we collaborate with Denmark, walking them through everything. At the end of the visit, one woman said, “I’m a member of the Danish Parliament.” I honestly hadn’t checked who was in the group. Then another man added, “I’m also a member of Parliament.”
They were genuinely moved — by how much we appreciated Denmark, how openly we talked about the partnership. She took a photo and posted it on Instagram. And that same day, just a few hours earlier, we had reopened the city’s fountains. They’d been shut down for three years — and now we finally managed to get them running again. It’s more than just water — the fountains are a source of joy, a meeting point, a symbol of life returning. In that photo, you see dozens of kids playing in the water. And in the background — the destroyed regional administration building, hit by a Russian missile.
That building has become a symbol. A turning point in our relationship with Denmark. Because on March 29, 2022 — when that missile struck — 38 civilians died. Staff from the regional administration, court workers — people who were just doing their jobs. That same day, President Zelensky addressed the Danish Parliament. He said, “Today, Mykolaiv was attacked. Please help Mykolaiv.” And that plea sparked a new phase of cooperation. Under her Instagram post, the MP wrote that visiting Ukraine made her realize how trivial her own country’s problems were by comparison. She said she was blown away by the resilience and optimism of Ukrainians. The Danes truly, deeply support us. They’re a small country — but with a huge heart.
When is the water coming back?
VIKTOR
And I think it’s not just about how the Danes see us — it’s also a wake-up call for Ukrainians themselves. To recognize what true support and solidarity look like. One of the biggest issues facing Mykolaiv is water. Russian forces destroyed the infrastructure that delivered water to the city. Now, the new pipeline is nearly finished — it’s expected to be operational by late summer or early fall. What are your expectations? Do you share the same optimism as Mr. Sukhomlyn? And secondly, during our podcast, he mentioned something that really surprised me: that Mykolaiv loses around 60% of the water that’s delivered…
OLEKSANDR
That’s true. We’re working on that too. Let me give you a bit of context first. On April 12, 2022, Russian troops destroyed the pipeline that carried water from the Dnipro River to Mykolaiv. Unfortunately, the city’s underground water is of extremely poor quality. We’re located between two rivers — the Southern Bug and the Inhul — but the water in them is salty. Not because the rivers are close to the Black Sea, but because the city itself is.
To give you an idea: even before the war, dolphins used to swim up into Mykolaiv. Our emergency services would have to help guide them back to sea. So when Kherson was occupied, I gave the order to start drilling wells at hospitals. I knew what had happened in Crimea — when Russia cut off the North Crimean Canal. They would do the same to us. And they did — they held out until April and then blew up the pipes. That left us completely without water. After Kherson was liberated, we managed to rebuild some of the infrastructure and started pumping Dnipro water again. Drinking water slowly returned to the city. But from April to May 2022, we had absolutely no water. The whole country helped us — trucks arrived with bottled water, volunteers delivered gallons, cities like Odesa sent in huge tankers. Everyone pitched in however they could.
We made the decision to use water from the Southern Bug — even though we could only partially treat it. We weren’t able to remove the salt content, so now the water coming out of people’s taps is salty. That salt damages pipes, household appliances, bathroom fixtures — everything. But now, three years after the crisis began, Mykolaiv residents finally have some hope.
The new pipeline is being built — and it’ll draw in water from the Southern Bug, but from a cleaner part of the river, upstream. That’s one step forward. But there’s another issue. Our water treatment plants were designed to process Dnipro water. Even if, hypothetically, peace comes tomorrow and we regain access to the Dnipro, we still wouldn’t be able to use it immediately.
First — the pumping station by the Dnipro was completely destroyed by shelling. Second — it was also flooded after the Kakhovka dam was blown up. Third — the Kakhovka Reservoir used to act as a giant natural filter for the Dnipro. It allowed for sedimentation and aeration — especially as water passed through the dam. Now, all of that is gone. So even if we resume access, we’d still need to rebuild and modernize our treatment plants. Right now, Ukraine’s State Agency for Restoration, headed by Serhiy Sukhomlyn, is working on that. But we’ll need a much stronger, more advanced system in the future.
As for the leaks — there’s a term for that: “non-revenue water.” It’s water that’s lost due to pipe damage — and yes, much of it was caused by the salty water. We’re losing huge volumes. We’ve started taking a more comprehensive approach. Thanks to Danish funding, we’re replacing major pipelines in entire neighborhoods. The regional administration also had a state-funded project — they’ve replaced large-diameter pipes (500 mm and up). We’ve also secured a grant from NEFCO — they’re going to help us replace old pipes with new plastic ones across several districts. These are longer-lasting and more efficient. At the same time, we’re installing water meters and integrating a geographic information system. That way, if there’s abnormal usage or sudden drops in pressure, we’ll know immediately — it’ll show us exactly where the leak is. All of this will be managed by Mykolaivvodokanal, our local water utility. Another important point: people in Mykolaiv have been walking to water distribution points for three years now. Thanks to our partners — especially Denmark, but also Germany, Israel, and others — we’ve installed 265 water stations across the city. Some rely on wells, others on tap water. But in all of them, the water is filtered through reverse osmosis systems and made safe for drinking — and it’s free.
What’s the result? We’ve become more resilient. People here joke: if there’s a blackout, we light candles and have a romantic dinner. If there’s no water — we get stronger. Every day, people walk to collect two five-liter bottles of clean water and carry them home. If you live in a building with an elevator — fine. But if you’re in a five-story walk-up with no elevator — it’s tough. Especially for the elderly. So yes — everyone’s waiting for this pipeline. Ask anyone in the city: what matters most? You could tell them, “Hey, we just got a great new excavator.” They’ll say: “That’s nice. But when will we get real water?” You could say, “We fixed this or that.” They’ll ask again: “Yes, but when will the water be fixed?” Even when we announce that Denmark helped us with something — their first question is: “Okay, but what about the water?” It’s on everyone’s mind.
One good thing — we’re now equipping those water stations with diesel generators and solar panels. So even if there’s a blackout — while other cities might lose access to water because their systems run on electric pumps — Mykolaiv will still have water. More importantly, people will know exactly where to go to get it. Even after the war ends, we plan to keep using and maintaining these stations. In case of future emergencies — earthquakes, floods, whatever — people will know where to go. Their neighborhood water point will be there.
Are there burial places available in Mykolaiv? The city authorities explain the situation.
VIKTOR
Before we sat down with you today, my colleagues and I spoke with local residents to hear about the issues that matter most to them. Water was number one — without question. People told us it’s heartbreaking to come home at night and have to bathe in water that’s not even safe. But there’s another major issue: burial. Because of the high number of military deaths, and just the general death toll in the city, the cemeteries are reportedly full. We’ve heard people are being sent to other cities — like Odesa — and that it’s expensive and complicated.
OLEKSANDR
I can tell you — people who are facing this issue often just don’t have the right information. We have a municipal company called “Ritual Services”. And we do still have space in our cemeteries for burials. Even at older cemeteries, we can still bury people in family plots or shared sites. Yes, we currently only have one fully active cemetery. But there’s still enough space. We’ve also designated separate military sectors within each cemetery — because sadly, there’s a need. Mykolaiv is a huge city — it spans about 1,200 square kilometers. And that makes it hard for people to move from one side of the city to another. That said, we’ve actually improved our public transport system even during wartime. For example, Denmark has recently agreed to fund the production of 9 additional trolleybuses with autonomous battery range. So yes — we’re continuing to modernize. But the main issue here is lack of public awareness.
There’s this bizarre trend: the moment someone passes away, certain “ritual service” companies start calling the family and offering their services. They somehow find out almost immediately. That info might be coming from police, medical workers — who knows. But if you want to go through the official process — it’s “Ritual Services.” They handle civilian burials, military burials, and even the national program for burying unidentified bodies. They’re also working on building a columbarium — which will be a first for Mykolaiv. Cremation is becoming more common. And as I like to say — if you came from nowhere, maybe you don’t need to take up two square meters of earth for eternity. Just let yourself go peacefully. There’s real demand for this. We also had a recent discussion about something else: A lot of people left the country during the war, and they can’t return right now. That means they’re not able to visit or maintain the graves of their loved ones. So we’re planning to offer a new service. Our municipal company will find the grave, take a “before” photo, clean the site, and take an “after” photo. You’ll be able to pay officially — online — and the team will handle everything.
VIKTOR
That’s actually a very business-savvy approach. And for people, it really matters.
OLEKSANDR
It does. Many feel a sense of guilt that they can’t come back, especially during important remembrance days. Now, they’ll at least have a way to ensure their family graves are cared for. Because in our culture, a neglected grave is seen as a shame for the relatives.
Peace, Jobs, Renewal: Mykolaiv’s Strategy for Tomorrow
VIKTOR
Let’s shift to another identity of Mykolaiv. It’s a port city — or at least it used to be. Do you see it returning to that role in the future? And more broadly — what’s your vision for Mykolaiv after the war?
OLEKSANDR
First of all, we need peace. Then we need security guarantees. Only then can we start talking about growth and investment — including port development. Right now, our port isn’t operating. But it could. Geographically, Mykolaiv is very well positioned to develop its logistics infrastructure and reenter global trade routes. But there’s something I keep saying at every meeting, every podcast: The future of Mykolaiv depends on the right kind of post-war national policy — one that recognizes the different levels of destruction and risk across Ukraine. What do I mean by that? We need to offer economic incentives based on geography and war impact. Right now, think about it: Why would any investor choose to put their money into Mykolaiv — a city that still gets shelled — when they could go to Vinnytsia, Khmelnytskyi, Lviv, or Chernivtsi? Some of those cities don’t even have a curfew anymore.
If taxes are the same across the country — why would anyone pick the riskier location? Business is about profit. Profit depends on risk. If you take higher risks, you should be able to earn higher profits. If the profits are the same, but the risks are not — no one’s going to invest here. So we need to introduce what I call an “economic gradient.” After the war, Ukraine should divide its territory into zones based on how much damage they suffered — and provide economic tools to help the hardest-hit regions recover. Let’s take the United States as an example. Everyone knows Delaware — a small state with zero VAT. Companies go there to save on taxes. It helped turn Delaware into one of the most business-friendly states. We need similar thinking here. I often meet with government officials — high-level decision-makers at ministries. And they all say the same thing: “Create an industrial park.” As if that’s the solution to everything. Sure, we can create an industrial park. But again — why would anyone invest in one in Mykolaiv, when they can build it in Lviv instead and just ship goods across Ukraine using our cheap rail system? That’s the real question. Our country is standing at a crossroads. We need to figure out the “professional identity” of each region — their specialization. Ukraine must be stitched together with economic connections. Some regions should produce. Others should process, finish, distribute.
VIKTOR
So what’s Mykolaiv’s identity?
OLEKSANDR
Mykolaiv has always been about logistics and processing. Second — engineering and shipbuilding. This is the city that built all of the Soviet Union’s aircraft carriers. Most of their warships came from here too — including the infamous Moskva, now feeding fish at the bottom of the sea. We also have a strong engineering university focused on naval design. One of our factories still produces turbines. Before the war, it was our biggest taxpayer. Of course, it’s not operating now — the Russians targeted it repeatedly. But I hope we can bring it back.
That said — big shipbuilding probably won’t be our future. Modern warfare has changed. Small drones and swarms of fast vessels have proven more effective than giant fleets. So priorities have shifted. Also, shipbuilding requires cheap steel. And since Russia destroyed Azovstal and other plants in eastern Ukraine, we won’t be producing steel at the needed scale any time soon. That’s why we need to look for new ideas — innovation, R&D, IT. I actually came from the IT sector before becoming mayor. And I believe Mykolaiv, like much of Ukraine, has massive potential in tech and entrepreneurship. Our cost of living is low — which makes us competitive globally. We can absolutely become an IT hub. But here’s the key: If we want people to stay in Mykolaiv, we need to create jobs. Well-paid, meaningful jobs. Once that’s in place, we can start talking about rebuilding kindergartens, schools, parks, and public spaces. But it all starts with employment. That’s what keeps people rooted in a city. That’s what gives them hope and dignity.
VIKTOR
Let’s go back for a moment. In 2022, you said in an interview that after the war, you’d organize the best City Day celebration Mykolaiv has had in 30–40 years. What message would you like to share with your fellow citizens today?
OLEKSANDR
What I said was — all of us, the people of Mykolaiv, would organize it together. And I still believe that. I think every city in Ukraine will have its day. We used to complain about everything — poor service in hospitals, bad restaurants… But now that life has scattered Ukrainians all over the world, they’ve come to realize just how much we actually had. We just didn’t appreciate it. Today, peace and calm, victory and the return of our territories — that’s priority number one. When peace returns, we’ll be overjoyed simply by the fact that no one is dying anymore. No one will be forced to go fight and die. We often call our soldiers heroes — and they are. But recently, at the opening of a memorial, I said this: It’s not that they “gave” their lives. Their lives were taken from them.
They could’ve lived, grown, thrived — but the Russians took that away. They killed our soldiers, they killed our civilians. When this bloody madness ends — that will be the greatest relief of all. And City Days, Independence Days — they’ll feel different. Because this time, we’re earning our independence. In 1991, it was granted. Now, we’re fighting for it. So yes — the joy will come. There will be music. There will be dancing. There will be happiness. For Mykolaiv’s 230th anniversary, over 60,000 people came to the main square. I’m sure the next time — it will be even bigger.
VIKTOR
And one final question. If you could go back and give yourself three pieces of advice in 2020 or 2021 — knowing what would happen on February 24 — what would you say?
OLEKSANDR
That’s a tough one. I wasn’t prepared for that. First — I’d tell myself to document everything. There were people who helped us a lot. And later, law enforcement would come asking what we did, how we did it. We had no records. We were just reacting in the moment. Second — honestly, I think we did everything right. I was one of the few who truly believed the war was coming, even when others didn’t. On day one, we had radios and the Zello app installed on every phone. The biggest issue in those early days was the lack of communication — or poor communication. From day two, we started organizing on Zello. So really — don’t be afraid. Rely on your people. And prepare for the unthinkable — because the Russians will do the unthinkable. And finally — don’t lose hope. And always support the military.
VIKTOR
Let’s keep doing our part. That was our conversation with Oleksandr Senkevych, the mayor of Mykolaiv. Thank you for your time, thank you for everything you’re doing — and thank you to our defenders for allowing us to breathe freely in a sovereign country.
OLEKSANDR
Thank you for having me. Invite me again — I’d be happy to keep discussing what matters.
This episode was translated from Ukrainian and adapted into English with the help of artificial intelligence. The text has been reviewed to preserve the meaning and natural flow of the conversation.